Talk:Dwarfs - Revision history

Old Dickens at 16:14, 27 February 2023

2023-02-27T16:14:36Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:14, 27 February 2023
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	:The OED and Dictionary.com both give pl. "elves". I don't hear anyone saying "elfs". The seven dwarves and the shoemaker and the elves both predate Tolkien, never mind Pratchett. Samuel Johnson used "elves" and "dwarfs"; maybe that's how the awkward form survives. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:25, 20 February 2023 (UTC)		:The OED and Dictionary.com both give pl. "elves". I don't hear anyone saying "elfs". The seven dwarves and the shoemaker and the elves both predate Tolkien, never mind Pratchett. Samuel Johnson used "elves" and "dwarfs"; maybe that's how the awkward form survives. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:25, 20 February 2023 (UTC)

	::It seems pretty clear that Pratchett preferred “dwarfs”, and as a keen Tolkien scholar this may be because he knew (or discovered before writing {{WS}}) that [https://scifi.stackexchange.com/questions/103179/why-is-it-dwarves-and-not-dwarfs Tolkien later considered “dwarves” a mistake], with the “correct” plural being dwarfs. Since the modern division in usage between the spellings comes from Tolkien’s usage, it seems likely Pratchett chose to use the “f” to honour a literary hero’s wishes. The books are pretty consistent, with {{ER}} the only one to use “dwarves”. None of the other books before {{WS}} use the plural of dwarf, and from that point on it’s invariably “dwarfs”. Interestingly, this change is also found - in my digital editions at least - in the modern “Introducing Discworld” text at the front of the book; titles up until ''Wyrd Sisters'' use the spelling “dwarves”, while from ''Wyrd Sisters'' on they use “dwarfs”. -- [[User:Guybrush\|Guybrush]] ([[User talk:Guybrush\|talk]]) 07:15, 27 February 2023 (UTC)		::It seems pretty clear that Pratchett preferred “dwarfs”, and as a keen Tolkien scholar this may be because he knew (or discovered before writing {{WS}}) that [https://scifi.stackexchange.com/questions/103179/why-is-it-dwarves-and-not-dwarfs Tolkien later considered “dwarves” a mistake]<SUP>1</SUP>, with the “correct” plural being dwarfs. Since the modern division in usage between the spellings comes from Tolkien’s usage, it seems likely Pratchett chose to use the “f” to honour a literary hero’s wishes. The books are pretty consistent, with {{ER}} the only one to use “dwarves”. None of the other books before {{WS}} use the plural of dwarf, and from that point on it’s invariably “dwarfs”. Interestingly, this change is also found - in my digital editions at least - in the modern “Introducing Discworld” text at the front of the book; titles up until ''Wyrd Sisters'' use the spelling “dwarves”, while from ''Wyrd Sisters'' on they use “dwarfs”. -- [[User:Guybrush\|Guybrush]] ([[User talk:Guybrush\|talk]]) 07:15, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

			<SUP>1</SUP> ''I think of it as more an improvement. (Dictionaries list both now.)'' --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 16:14, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

	== Many words for 'gold' or 'rock'? ==		== Many words for 'gold' or 'rock'? ==

Guybrush: /* Hoofs, Rooves and Elfs */

2023-02-27T07:17:11Z

Hoofs, Rooves and Elfs

← Older revision		Revision as of 07:17, 27 February 2023
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	:The OED and Dictionary.com both give pl. "elves". I don't hear anyone saying "elfs". The seven dwarves and the shoemaker and the elves both predate Tolkien, never mind Pratchett. Samuel Johnson used "elves" and "dwarfs"; maybe that's how the awkward form survives. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:25, 20 February 2023 (UTC)		:The OED and Dictionary.com both give pl. "elves". I don't hear anyone saying "elfs". The seven dwarves and the shoemaker and the elves both predate Tolkien, never mind Pratchett. Samuel Johnson used "elves" and "dwarfs"; maybe that's how the awkward form survives. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:25, 20 February 2023 (UTC)

	::It seems pretty clear that Pratchett preferred “dwarfs”, and as a keen Tolkien scholar this may be because he knew (or discovered before writing {{WS}}) that [https://scifi.stackexchange.com/questions/103179/why-is-it-dwarves-and-not-dwarfs Tolkien later considered “dwarves” a mistake], with the “correct” plural being dwarfs. Since the modern division in usage between the spellings comes from Tolkien’s usage, it seems likely Pratchett chose to use the “f” to honour a literary hero’s wishes. The books are pretty consistent, with {{ER}} the only one to use “dwarves”. None of the other books before {{WS}} use the plural of dwarf, and from that point on ~~its~~ “dwarfs”. Interestingly, this change is also found - in my digital editions at least - in the modern “Introducing Discworld” text at the front of the book; titles up until ''Wyrd Sisters'' use the spelling “dwarves”, while from ''Wyrd Sisters'' on they use “dwarfs”. -- [[User:Guybrush\|Guybrush]] ([[User talk:Guybrush\|talk]]) 07:15, 27 February 2023 (UTC)		::It seems pretty clear that Pratchett preferred “dwarfs”, and as a keen Tolkien scholar this may be because he knew (or discovered before writing {{WS}}) that [https://scifi.stackexchange.com/questions/103179/why-is-it-dwarves-and-not-dwarfs Tolkien later considered “dwarves” a mistake], with the “correct” plural being dwarfs. Since the modern division in usage between the spellings comes from Tolkien’s usage, it seems likely Pratchett chose to use the “f” to honour a literary hero’s wishes. The books are pretty consistent, with {{ER}} the only one to use “dwarves”. None of the other books before {{WS}} use the plural of dwarf, and from that point on it’s invariably “dwarfs”. Interestingly, this change is also found - in my digital editions at least - in the modern “Introducing Discworld” text at the front of the book; titles up until ''Wyrd Sisters'' use the spelling “dwarves”, while from ''Wyrd Sisters'' on they use “dwarfs”. -- [[User:Guybrush\|Guybrush]] ([[User talk:Guybrush\|talk]]) 07:15, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

	== Many words for 'gold' or 'rock'? ==		== Many words for 'gold' or 'rock'? ==

Guybrush: /* Hoofs, Rooves and Elfs */ Ordering the recent conversation

2023-02-27T07:16:29Z

Hoofs, Rooves and Elfs: Ordering the recent conversation

← Older revision		Revision as of 07:16, 27 February 2023
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	Just to clarify an issue here. Dwarfs are small people with a certain medical condition (lacking growth hormone). Dwarves are a race (popularised by Tolkien, similarly elfs is the plural of elf, elves are another race popularised by JRRT). Perhaps Sir Terry changed the name because in the Discworld they are dwarves. [[User:Tag\|Tag]] ([[User talk:Tag\|talk]]) 17:54, 20 February 2023 (UTC)		Just to clarify an issue here. Dwarfs are small people with a certain medical condition (lacking growth hormone). Dwarves are a race (popularised by Tolkien, similarly elfs is the plural of elf, elves are another race popularised by JRRT). Perhaps Sir Terry changed the name because in the Discworld they are dwarves. [[User:Tag\|Tag]] ([[User talk:Tag\|talk]]) 17:54, 20 February 2023 (UTC)

	::The OED and Dictionary.com both give pl. "elves". I don't hear anyone saying "elfs". The seven dwarves and the shoemaker and the elves both predate Tolkien, never mind Pratchett. Samuel Johnson used "elves" and "dwarfs"; maybe that's how the awkward form survives. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:25, 20 February 2023 (UTC)		:The OED and Dictionary.com both give pl. "elves". I don't hear anyone saying "elfs". The seven dwarves and the shoemaker and the elves both predate Tolkien, never mind Pratchett. Samuel Johnson used "elves" and "dwarfs"; maybe that's how the awkward form survives. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:25, 20 February 2023 (UTC)

	:It seems pretty clear that Pratchett preferred “dwarfs”, and as a keen Tolkien scholar this may be because he knew (or discovered before writing {{WS}}) that [https://scifi.stackexchange.com/questions/103179/why-is-it-dwarves-and-not-dwarfs Tolkien later considered “dwarves” a mistake], with the “correct” plural being dwarfs. Since the modern division in usage between the spellings comes from Tolkien’s usage, it seems likely Pratchett chose to use the “f” to honour a literary hero’s wishes. The books are pretty consistent, with {{ER}} the only one to use “dwarves”. None of the other books before {{WS}} use the plural of dwarf, and from that point on its “dwarfs”. Interestingly, this change is also found - in my digital editions at least - in the modern “Introducing Discworld” text at the front of the book; titles up until ''Wyrd Sisters'' use the spelling “dwarves”, while from ''Wyrd Sisters'' on they use “dwarfs”. -- [[User:Guybrush\|Guybrush]] ([[User talk:Guybrush\|talk]]) 07:15, 27 February 2023 (UTC)		::It seems pretty clear that Pratchett preferred “dwarfs”, and as a keen Tolkien scholar this may be because he knew (or discovered before writing {{WS}}) that [https://scifi.stackexchange.com/questions/103179/why-is-it-dwarves-and-not-dwarfs Tolkien later considered “dwarves” a mistake], with the “correct” plural being dwarfs. Since the modern division in usage between the spellings comes from Tolkien’s usage, it seems likely Pratchett chose to use the “f” to honour a literary hero’s wishes. The books are pretty consistent, with {{ER}} the only one to use “dwarves”. None of the other books before {{WS}} use the plural of dwarf, and from that point on its “dwarfs”. Interestingly, this change is also found - in my digital editions at least - in the modern “Introducing Discworld” text at the front of the book; titles up until ''Wyrd Sisters'' use the spelling “dwarves”, while from ''Wyrd Sisters'' on they use “dwarfs”. -- [[User:Guybrush\|Guybrush]] ([[User talk:Guybrush\|talk]]) 07:15, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

	== Many words for 'gold' or 'rock'? ==		== Many words for 'gold' or 'rock'? ==

Guybrush: /* Hoofs, Rooves and Elfs */

2023-02-27T07:15:24Z

Hoofs, Rooves and Elfs

← Older revision		Revision as of 07:15, 27 February 2023
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	Just to clarify an issue here. Dwarfs are small people with a certain medical condition (lacking growth hormone). Dwarves are a race (popularised by Tolkien, similarly elfs is the plural of elf, elves are another race popularised by JRRT). Perhaps Sir Terry changed the name because in the Discworld they are dwarves. [[User:Tag\|Tag]] ([[User talk:Tag\|talk]]) 17:54, 20 February 2023 (UTC)		Just to clarify an issue here. Dwarfs are small people with a certain medical condition (lacking growth hormone). Dwarves are a race (popularised by Tolkien, similarly elfs is the plural of elf, elves are another race popularised by JRRT). Perhaps Sir Terry changed the name because in the Discworld they are dwarves. [[User:Tag\|Tag]] ([[User talk:Tag\|talk]]) 17:54, 20 February 2023 (UTC)

	::The OED and Dictionary.com both give pl. "elves". I don't hear anyone saying "elfs". The seven dwarves and the shoemaker and the elves both predate Tolkien, never mind Pratchett. Samuel Johnson used "elves" and "dwarfs"; maybe that's how the awkward form survives. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:25, 20 February 2023 (UTC)		::The OED and Dictionary.com both give pl. "elves". I don't hear anyone saying "elfs". The seven dwarves and the shoemaker and the elves both predate Tolkien, never mind Pratchett. Samuel Johnson used "elves" and "dwarfs"; maybe that's how the awkward form survives. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:25, 20 February 2023 (UTC)

			:It seems pretty clear that Pratchett preferred “dwarfs”, and as a keen Tolkien scholar this may be because he knew (or discovered before writing {{WS}}) that [https://scifi.stackexchange.com/questions/103179/why-is-it-dwarves-and-not-dwarfs Tolkien later considered “dwarves” a mistake], with the “correct” plural being dwarfs. Since the modern division in usage between the spellings comes from Tolkien’s usage, it seems likely Pratchett chose to use the “f” to honour a literary hero’s wishes. The books are pretty consistent, with {{ER}} the only one to use “dwarves”. None of the other books before {{WS}} use the plural of dwarf, and from that point on its “dwarfs”. Interestingly, this change is also found - in my digital editions at least - in the modern “Introducing Discworld” text at the front of the book; titles up until ''Wyrd Sisters'' use the spelling “dwarves”, while from ''Wyrd Sisters'' on they use “dwarfs”. -- [[User:Guybrush\|Guybrush]] ([[User talk:Guybrush\|talk]]) 07:15, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

	== Many words for 'gold' or 'rock'? ==		== Many words for 'gold' or 'rock'? ==

Guybrush: /* Dwarf Songs */

2023-02-27T06:53:03Z

Dwarf Songs

← Older revision		Revision as of 06:53, 27 February 2023
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	:The link to an abc translator that was provided is dead. You may be able to Google another.		:The link to an abc translator that was provided is dead. You may be able to Google another.
			::Here’s one that works, though you’ll need to copy and paste yourself: [https://spuds.thursdaycontra.com/SPUDSConverter.html SPUDS No-frills abc Converter] -- [[User:Guybrush\|Guybrush]] ([[User talk:Guybrush\|talk]]) 06:53, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

Old Dickens at 19:26, 20 February 2023

2023-02-20T19:26:42Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:26, 20 February 2023
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	:There are a number of examples of dwarfs. I don't know about dwarves. --Confusion 02:56, 1 December 2011 (CET)		:There are a number of examples of dwarfs. I don't know about dwarves. --Confusion 02:56, 1 December 2011 (CET)

	Has anyone heard a reason why The Author switched from Dwarves to Dwarfs sometime after {{ER}}? --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:04, 15 February 2017 (UTC)		::Has anyone heard a reason why The Author switched from Dwarves to Dwarfs sometime after {{ER}}? --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:04, 15 February 2017 (UTC)

	Just to clarify an issue here. Dwarfs are small people with a certain medical condition (lacking growth hormone). Dwarves are a race (popularised by Tolkien, similarly elfs is the plural of elf, elves are another race popularised by JRRT). Perhaps Sir Terry changed the name because in the Discworld they are dwarves. [[User:Tag\|Tag]] ([[User talk:Tag\|talk]]) 17:54, 20 February 2023 (UTC)		Just to clarify an issue here. Dwarfs are small people with a certain medical condition (lacking growth hormone). Dwarves are a race (popularised by Tolkien, similarly elfs is the plural of elf, elves are another race popularised by JRRT). Perhaps Sir Terry changed the name because in the Discworld they are dwarves. [[User:Tag\|Tag]] ([[User talk:Tag\|talk]]) 17:54, 20 February 2023 (UTC)
			::The OED and Dictionary.com both give pl. "elves". I don't hear anyone saying "elfs". The seven dwarves and the shoemaker and the elves both predate Tolkien, never mind Pratchett. Samuel Johnson used "elves" and "dwarfs"; maybe that's how the awkward form survives. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:25, 20 February 2023 (UTC)

	== Many words for 'gold' or 'rock'? ==		== Many words for 'gold' or 'rock'? ==

Tag at 17:54, 20 February 2023

2023-02-20T17:54:06Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:54, 20 February 2023
Line 6:		Line 6:
	Has anyone heard a reason why The Author switched from Dwarves to Dwarfs sometime after {{ER}}? --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:04, 15 February 2017 (UTC)		Has anyone heard a reason why The Author switched from Dwarves to Dwarfs sometime after {{ER}}? --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:04, 15 February 2017 (UTC)

	Just to clarify an issue here. Dwarfs are small people with a certain medical condition (lacking growth hormone). Dwarves are a race (popularised by Tolkien, similarly elfs is the plural of elf, elves are another race popularised by JRRT). Perhaps Sir Terry changed the name because in the Discworld they are dwarves.		Just to clarify an issue here. Dwarfs are small people with a certain medical condition (lacking growth hormone). Dwarves are a race (popularised by Tolkien, similarly elfs is the plural of elf, elves are another race popularised by JRRT). Perhaps Sir Terry changed the name because in the Discworld they are dwarves. [[User:Tag\|Tag]] ([[User talk:Tag\|talk]]) 17:54, 20 February 2023 (UTC)

Tag at 17:46, 20 February 2023

2023-02-20T17:46:26Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:46, 20 February 2023
Line 5:		Line 5:

	Has anyone heard a reason why The Author switched from Dwarves to Dwarfs sometime after {{ER}}? --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:04, 15 February 2017 (UTC)		Has anyone heard a reason why The Author switched from Dwarves to Dwarfs sometime after {{ER}}? --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:04, 15 February 2017 (UTC)

			Just to clarify an issue here. Dwarfs are small people with a certain medical condition (lacking growth hormone). Dwarves are a race (popularised by Tolkien, similarly elfs is the plural of elf, elves are another race popularised by JRRT). Perhaps Sir Terry changed the name because in the Discworld they are dwarves.


	== Many words for 'gold' or 'rock'? ==		== Many words for 'gold' or 'rock'? ==

Old Dickens: dead link

2017-02-15T19:12:28Z

dead link

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:12, 15 February 2017
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	<br id="v8h924">		<br id="v8h924">
	w: Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold!</tt><br id="yc6m0">		w: Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold! Gold!</tt><br id="yc6m0">
	~~To convert the code above~~ to ~~sheet music, or listen~~ to ~~the tune, copy the code then paste it at this site: http://www~~.~~concertina.net/tunes_convert.html and [submit].~~
	~~<BR>~~		:The link to an abc translator that was provided is dead. You may be able to Google another.

Old Dickens: irregular plurals

2017-02-15T19:04:49Z

irregular plurals

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:04, 15 February 2017
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			==Hoofs, Rooves and Elfs==
	Does Pratchett dwarfs or dwarves?--[[User:Teletran\|Teletran]] 09:45, 27 January 2007 (CET)		Does Pratchett dwarfs or dwarves?--[[User:Teletran\|Teletran]] 09:45, 27 January 2007 (CET)
			:There are a number of examples of dwarfs. I don't know about dwarves. --Confusion 02:56, 1 December 2011 (CET)

	~~There are~~ a ~~number of examples of dwarfs. I don't know about dwarves.~~ --~~Confusion 02~~:56, ~~1 December 2011~~ (~~CET~~)		Has anyone heard a reason why The Author switched from Dwarves to Dwarfs sometime after {{ER}}? --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:04, 15 February 2017 (UTC)

	== Many words for 'gold' or 'rock'? ==		== Many words for 'gold' or 'rock'? ==