Talk:Sharn - Revision history

Guybrush at 23:17, 23 February 2025

2025-02-23T23:17:32Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 23:17, 23 February 2025
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	As mentioned initially, Pepe is pretty obviously male; the question was about Sharn. I suspect that The Author was playing silly buggers again and we're not supposed to know. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 02:03, 9 February 2025 (UTC)		As mentioned initially, Pepe is pretty obviously male; the question was about Sharn. I suspect that The Author was playing silly buggers again and we're not supposed to know. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 02:03, 9 February 2025 (UTC)
	::I came here after listening to Guybrush's podcast on UA, plus having listened to the new audio version. I was going to write, essentially, what Old Dickens wrote at the top of this page. He said it much more eloquently than I could, and in 2009, even. I likewise come to the quote about her being King and declaring herself "Queen", dressing up in female clothing. I read this as a male dwarf choosing to use a female persona. [[User:Moishe Rosenbaum\|Moishe Rosenbaum]] ([[User talk:Moishe Rosenbaum\|talk]]) 01:31, 19 February 2025 (UTC)		::I came here after listening to Guybrush's podcast on UA, plus having listened to the new audio version. I was going to write, essentially, what Old Dickens wrote at the top of this page. He said it much more eloquently than I could, and in 2009, even. I likewise come to the quote about her being King and declaring herself "Queen", dressing up in female clothing. I read this as a male dwarf choosing to use a female persona. [[User:Moishe Rosenbaum\|Moishe Rosenbaum]] ([[User talk:Moishe Rosenbaum\|talk]]) 01:31, 19 February 2025 (UTC)
			:::I agree now that this does seem to be the most likely case, and I was a bit surprised it didn’t occur to me during our discussion on the show. I suppose the nature of dwarf gender obscured the options a bit! -- [[User:Guybrush\|Guybrush]] ([[User talk:Guybrush\|talk]]) 23:17, 23 February 2025 (UTC)

Moishe Rosenbaum: Madam Sharn is a Queen

2025-02-19T01:31:39Z

Madam Sharn is a Queen

← Older revision		Revision as of 01:31, 19 February 2025
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	:Pratchett is on record describing Pepe, at least, as "as gay as a tree full of monkeys", so I think that makes his intent pretty clear? See [https://youtu.be/SG8xh9q1jBc?t=973 this recorded public interview from 2014] (I've linked to the start of the question where he says this). -- [[User:Guybrush\|Guybrush]] ([[User talk:Guybrush\|talk]]) 06:43, 29 January 2023 (UTC)		:Pratchett is on record describing Pepe, at least, as "as gay as a tree full of monkeys", so I think that makes his intent pretty clear? See [https://youtu.be/SG8xh9q1jBc?t=973 this recorded public interview from 2014] (I've linked to the start of the question where he says this). -- [[User:Guybrush\|Guybrush]] ([[User talk:Guybrush\|talk]]) 06:43, 29 January 2023 (UTC)
	As mentioned initially, Pepe is pretty obviously male; the question was about Sharn. I suspect that The Author was playing silly buggers again and we're not supposed to know. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 02:03, 9 February 2025 (UTC)		As mentioned initially, Pepe is pretty obviously male; the question was about Sharn. I suspect that The Author was playing silly buggers again and we're not supposed to know. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 02:03, 9 February 2025 (UTC)
			::I came here after listening to Guybrush's podcast on UA, plus having listened to the new audio version. I was going to write, essentially, what Old Dickens wrote at the top of this page. He said it much more eloquently than I could, and in 2009, even. I likewise come to the quote about her being King and declaring herself "Queen", dressing up in female clothing. I read this as a male dwarf choosing to use a female persona. [[User:Moishe Rosenbaum\|Moishe Rosenbaum]] ([[User talk:Moishe Rosenbaum\|talk]]) 01:31, 19 February 2025 (UTC)

Old Dickens at 02:03, 9 February 2025

2025-02-09T02:03:10Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 02:03, 9 February 2025
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	:This is interesting. I've always suspected that the "arrangement" between adult dwarves, when it comes to marriage, would in fact be a positive inducement for gay and lesbian Dwarfs to have long happy relationships. Who would know, for one thing, apart from the concerned Dwarfs themselves? And given that ninety per cent of a Dwarf courtship consists of trying to discreetly and subtly discover what gender the other Dwarf is under the chainmail and the beard... well, accidents must happen. And in a race even whose human member (Carrot) is notoriously prudish and hung-up on matters sexual, perhaps a lot of newly-married Dwarfs don't even realise they're in same-sex relationships and take it to be perfectly unremarkable that they each have the same set of genitals. They make the best of it, maybe? (As Tolkein said, ''the kind of the Dwarves grows only slowly''...)		:This is interesting. I've always suspected that the "arrangement" between adult dwarves, when it comes to marriage, would in fact be a positive inducement for gay and lesbian Dwarfs to have long happy relationships. Who would know, for one thing, apart from the concerned Dwarfs themselves? And given that ninety per cent of a Dwarf courtship consists of trying to discreetly and subtly discover what gender the other Dwarf is under the chainmail and the beard... well, accidents must happen. And in a race even whose human member (Carrot) is notoriously prudish and hung-up on matters sexual, perhaps a lot of newly-married Dwarfs don't even realise they're in same-sex relationships and take it to be perfectly unremarkable that they each have the same set of genitals. They make the best of it, maybe? (As Tolkein said, ''the kind of the Dwarves grows only slowly''...)

	:And on Roundworld, take a gay man, who for whatever reason cannot come out of the closet, who enters into a marriage of convenience with a woman as an attempt to present a heterosexual face to the world and divert attention (there are some, and they're not all Tory MP's). The face-saving, attention-diverting, wife or girlfriend of the closet gay is commonly nicknamed a '''''beard'''''... --[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 20:34, 1 November 2009 (UTC)		:And on Roundworld, take a gay man, who for whatever reason cannot come out of the closet, who enters into a marriage of convenience with a woman as an attempt to present a heterosexual face to the world and divert attention (there are some, and they're not all Tory MP's). The face-saving, attention-diverting, wife or girlfriend of the closet gay is commonly nicknamed a '''''beard'''''... --[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 20:34, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

	Pepe, though, is the anti-Carrot, somewhere beyond Giamo Casanunda in general deviance from classical Dwarfishness. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 21:31, 1 November 2009 (UTC)		Pepe, though, is the anti-Carrot, somewhere beyond Giamo Casanunda in general deviance from classical Dwarfishness. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 21:31, 1 November 2009 (UTC)
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	Thirteen years later, no conclusion on the initial question. Was that The Author's intention? --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 03:30, 29 November 2022 (UTC)		Thirteen years later, no conclusion on the initial question. Was that The Author's intention? --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 03:30, 29 November 2022 (UTC)
	:Pratchett is on record describing Pepe, at least, as "as gay as a tree full of monkeys", so I think that makes his intent pretty clear? See [https://youtu.be/SG8xh9q1jBc?t=973 this recorded public interview from 2014] (I've linked to the start of the question where he says this). -- [[User:Guybrush\|Guybrush]] ([[User talk:Guybrush\|talk]]) 06:43, 29 January 2023 (UTC)		:Pratchett is on record describing Pepe, at least, as "as gay as a tree full of monkeys", so I think that makes his intent pretty clear? See [https://youtu.be/SG8xh9q1jBc?t=973 this recorded public interview from 2014] (I've linked to the start of the question where he says this). -- [[User:Guybrush\|Guybrush]] ([[User talk:Guybrush\|talk]]) 06:43, 29 January 2023 (UTC)
			As mentioned initially, Pepe is pretty obviously male; the question was about Sharn. I suspect that The Author was playing silly buggers again and we're not supposed to know. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 02:03, 9 February 2025 (UTC)

Guybrush at 07:05, 29 January 2023

2023-01-29T07:05:27Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 07:05, 29 January 2023
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	Thirteen years later, no conclusion on the initial question. Was that The Author's intention? --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 03:30, 29 November 2022 (UTC)		Thirteen years later, no conclusion on the initial question. Was that The Author's intention? --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 03:30, 29 November 2022 (UTC)
	:Pratchett is on record describing Pepe, at least, as "as gay as a tree full of monkeys", so I think that makes his intent pretty clear? See [https://youtu.be/SG8xh9q1jBc this recorded public interview from 2014]. -- [[User:Guybrush\|Guybrush]] ([[User talk:Guybrush\|talk]]) 06:43, 29 January 2023 (UTC)		:Pratchett is on record describing Pepe, at least, as "as gay as a tree full of monkeys", so I think that makes his intent pretty clear? See [https://youtu.be/SG8xh9q1jBc?t=973 this recorded public interview from 2014] (I've linked to the start of the question where he says this). -- [[User:Guybrush\|Guybrush]] ([[User talk:Guybrush\|talk]]) 06:43, 29 January 2023 (UTC)

Guybrush: Word of God for his intention with Pepe, at least

2023-01-29T06:44:21Z

Word of God for his intention with Pepe, at least

← Older revision		Revision as of 06:44, 29 January 2023
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	Thirteen years later, no conclusion on the initial question. Was that The Author's intention? --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 03:30, 29 November 2022 (UTC)		Thirteen years later, no conclusion on the initial question. Was that The Author's intention? --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 03:30, 29 November 2022 (UTC)
			:Pratchett is on record describing Pepe, at least, as "as gay as a tree full of monkeys", so I think that makes his intent pretty clear? See [https://youtu.be/SG8xh9q1jBc this recorded public interview from 2014]. -- [[User:Guybrush\|Guybrush]] ([[User talk:Guybrush\|talk]]) 06:43, 29 January 2023 (UTC)

Old Dickens: ugh

2023-01-29T02:08:24Z

ugh

← Older revision		Revision as of 02:08, 29 January 2023
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	Assigning sexes to Dwarves, and Dwarf sexuality in general, ~~have~~ always been tricky. When we encounter a Dwarf/Human couple, both of whom are quite ambiguous, we have new problems. Pepe seems to be male: he refers to himself before his conversion to Dwarf as a "Lobbin Clout boy", and other indications point to a male homosexual. What do we make of "Madame" Sharn, then? "She" says that she is the King in her "mine" and she decrees that she is Queen. "Queen", of course, carries extra meanings. On the other hand, Pepe puts aside the camp persona when off-stage; is the orientation itself a pose? Why then does he mention being beaten up a lot in his youth?		Assigning sexes to Dwarves, and Dwarf sexuality in general, has always been tricky. When we encounter a Dwarf/Human couple, both of whom are quite ambiguous, we have new problems. Pepe seems to be male: he refers to himself before his conversion to Dwarf as a "Lobbin Clout boy", and other indications point to a male homosexual. What do we make of "Madame" Sharn, then? "She" says that she is the King in her "mine" and she decrees that she is Queen. "Queen", of course, carries extra meanings. On the other hand, Pepe puts aside the camp persona when off-stage; is the orientation itself a pose? Why then does he mention being beaten up a lot in his youth?

	On page 160 in my first reading I made a note asking if Sharn were male, then discounted the idea when no confirmation emerged. I now return to the hypothesis as the most reasonable of an eye-watering array of options. Can anyone assemble a better argument for another version? . [[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 18:02, 1 Nov 2009		On page 160 in my first reading I made a note asking if Sharn were male, then discounted the idea when no confirmation emerged. I now return to the hypothesis as the most reasonable of an eye-watering array of options. Can anyone assemble a better argument for another version? . [[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 18:02, 1 Nov 2009

	:This is interesting. I've always suspected that the "arrangement" between adult dwarves, ~~wnen~~ it comes to marriage, would in fact be a positive inducement for gay and lesbian Dwarfs to have long happy relationships. Who would know, for one thing, apart from the concerned Dwarfs themselves? And given that ninety per cent of a Dwarf courtship consists of trying to discreetly and subtly discover what gender the other Dwarf is under the chainmail and the beard... well, accidents must happen. And in a race even whose human member (Carrot) is notoriously prudish and hung-up on matters sexual, perhaps a lot of newly-married Dwarfs don't even realise they're in same-sex relationships and take it to be perfectly ~~unremarkeable~~ that they each have the same set of genitals. They make the best of it, maybe? (As Tolkein said, ''the kind of the Dwarves grows only slowly''...)		:This is interesting. I've always suspected that the "arrangement" between adult dwarves, when it comes to marriage, would in fact be a positive inducement for gay and lesbian Dwarfs to have long happy relationships. Who would know, for one thing, apart from the concerned Dwarfs themselves? And given that ninety per cent of a Dwarf courtship consists of trying to discreetly and subtly discover what gender the other Dwarf is under the chainmail and the beard... well, accidents must happen. And in a race even whose human member (Carrot) is notoriously prudish and hung-up on matters sexual, perhaps a lot of newly-married Dwarfs don't even realise they're in same-sex relationships and take it to be perfectly unremarkable that they each have the same set of genitals. They make the best of it, maybe? (As Tolkein said, ''the kind of the Dwarves grows only slowly''...)

	:And on Roundworld, take a gay man, who for whatever reason cannot come out of the closet, who enters into a marriage of convenience with a woman as an attempt to present a heterosexual face to the world and divert attention (there are some, and they're not all Tory MP's). The face-saving, attention-diverting, wife or girlfriend of the closet gay is commonly nicknamed a '''''beard'''''... --[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 20:34, 1 November 2009 (UTC)		:And on Roundworld, take a gay man, who for whatever reason cannot come out of the closet, who enters into a marriage of convenience with a woman as an attempt to present a heterosexual face to the world and divert attention (there are some, and they're not all Tory MP's). The face-saving, attention-diverting, wife or girlfriend of the closet gay is commonly nicknamed a '''''beard'''''... --[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 20:34, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Old Dickens: still pending; indents

2022-11-29T03:30:43Z

still pending; indents

← Older revision		Revision as of 03:30, 29 November 2022
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	On page 160 in my first reading I made a note asking if Sharn were male, then discounted the idea when no confirmation emerged. I now return to the hypothesis as the most reasonable of an eye-watering array of options. Can anyone assemble a better argument for another version? . [[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 18:02, 1 Nov 2009		On page 160 in my first reading I made a note asking if Sharn were male, then discounted the idea when no confirmation emerged. I now return to the hypothesis as the most reasonable of an eye-watering array of options. Can anyone assemble a better argument for another version? . [[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 18:02, 1 Nov 2009

			:This is interesting. I've always suspected that the "arrangement" between adult dwarves, wnen it comes to marriage, would in fact be a positive inducement for gay and lesbian Dwarfs to have long happy relationships. Who would know, for one thing, apart from the concerned Dwarfs themselves? And given that ninety per cent of a Dwarf courtship consists of trying to discreetly and subtly discover what gender the other Dwarf is under the chainmail and the beard... well, accidents must happen. And in a race even whose human member (Carrot) is notoriously prudish and hung-up on matters sexual, perhaps a lot of newly-married Dwarfs don't even realise they're in same-sex relationships and take it to be perfectly unremarkeable that they each have the same set of genitals. They make the best of it, maybe? (As Tolkein said, ''the kind of the Dwarves grows only slowly''...)

	~~This is interesting. I've always suspected that the "arrangement" between adult dwarves~~, ~~wnen it comes to marriage, would in fact be~~ a ~~positive inducement for~~ gay ~~and lesbian Dwarfs to have long happy relationships. Who would know~~, for ~~one thing~~, ~~apart from the concerned Dwarfs themselves? And given that ninety per cent~~ of a ~~Dwarf courtship consists of trying~~ to ~~discreetly and subtly discover what gender the other Dwarf is under~~ the ~~chainmail~~ and ~~the beard... well~~, ~~accidents must happen. And in a race even whose human member (Carrot) is notoriously prudish~~ and ~~hung-up on matters sexual, perhaps a lot of newly-married Dwarfs don't even realise~~ they're ~~in same~~-~~sex relationships and take it to be perfectly unremarkeable that they each have the same set~~ of ~~genitals. They make~~ the ~~best of it, maybe?~~ ~~(As Tolkein said,~~ ''~~the kind of the Dwarves grows only slowly~~''...)		:And on Roundworld, take a gay man, who for whatever reason cannot come out of the closet, who enters into a marriage of convenience with a woman as an attempt to present a heterosexual face to the world and divert attention (there are some, and they're not all Tory MP's). The face-saving, attention-diverting, wife or girlfriend of the closet gay is commonly nicknamed a '''''beard'''''... --[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 20:34, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

	~~And on Roundworld~~, ~~take a gay man~~, ~~who for whatever reason cannot come out of the closet, who enters into a marriage of convenience with a woman as an attempt to present a heterosexual face to~~ the ~~world and divert attention (there are some, and they're not all Tory MP's). The face~~-~~saving~~, ~~attention-diverting, wife or girlfriend of the closet gay is commonly nicknamed a '''''beard'''''..~~. --[[User:~~AgProv~~\|~~AgProv~~]] 20:34, 1 November 2009 (UTC)		Pepe, though, is the anti-Carrot, somewhere beyond Giamo Casanunda in general deviance from classical Dwarfishness. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 21:31, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

	:Pepe, ~~though,~~ is the ~~anti~~-~~Carrot~~, ~~somewhere beyond Giamo Casanunda~~ in ~~general deviance from classical Dwarfishness~~. -~~-[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 21:31~~, ~~1 November 2009 (UTC)~~		::I read Pepe as a genuinely gay human male (although possibly short) who's escaped the Crab Bucket through drink and expressing his homosexuality so overtly that people ignore him - a bit like funny loony monks, beggars or even Death: he is granted immunity by being too obvious. I don't think he does drop the persona "off-stage", it's just that the ''outre'' campness is in abeyance when talking to those he trusts. Being gay is one thing - having no other life or ''raison d'etre'' than ''being'' gay must be terribly wearying. We all know people who, if they weren't gay, would have nothing else to be. Pepe is far more than this.

	::I ~~read Pepe as a genuinely gay human male (~~although ~~possibly short) who's escaped~~ the ~~Crab Bucket through drink~~ and ~~expressing his homosexuality so overtly~~ that ~~people ignore him~~ - a ~~bit like funny loony monks~~, ~~beggars or even Death: he is granted immunity by being too obvious.~~ I ~~don't think he does drop the persona "off-stage"~~, ~~it's just that the ''outre'' campness is~~ in ~~abeyance when talking to those he trusts~~. ~~Being gay is one thing~~ - ~~having no other life or ''raison d'etre'' than ''being'' gay must~~ be ~~terribly wearying. We all know people~~ who~~, if they weren't gay,~~ would ~~have nothing else~~ to ~~be. Pepe is far more than this~~.		::I do find his final act odd though - although deeply satisfying to the reader. Someone so at ease with themselves is unlikely to be so desperately angry still at his past experience. In my experience, people either wear their previously-borne slings and arrows with pride or gratitude that it's made them who they are.--[[User:Knmatt\|Knmatt]] 09:15, 2 November 2009 (UTC)
			You meet a kinder, gentler class of people than I do, in fact or fiction. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 00:19, 3 November 2009 (UTC)
			There would be also a class who would try to improve the prospect for others and discourage the abusers, even while espousing the sentiments above. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 03:26, 17 February 2019 (UTC)

	~~I do find his final act odd though - although deeply satisfying to~~ the ~~reader. Someone so at ease with themselves is unlikely to be so desperately angry still at his past experience~~. ~~In my experience, people either wear their previously-borne slings and arrows with pride or gratitude~~ that it's ~~made them who they are.--[[User:Knmatt\|Knmatt]] 09:15, 2 November 2009 (UTC)~~		Thirteen years later, no conclusion on the initial question. Was that The Author's intention? --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 03:30, 29 November 2022 (UTC)
	~~:You meet a kinder, gentler class of people than I do, in fact or fiction. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 00:19, 3 November 2009 (UTC)~~
	~~:There would be also a class who would try to improve the prospect for others and discourage the abusers, even while espousing the sentiments above.~~ --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 03:26, ~~17 February 2019~~ (UTC)

Old Dickens: 10 year update

2019-02-17T03:26:52Z

10 year update

← Older revision		Revision as of 03:26, 17 February 2019
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	I do find his final act odd though - although deeply satisfying to the reader. Someone so at ease with themselves is unlikely to be so desperately angry still at his past experience. In my experience, people either wear their previously-borne slings and arrows with pride or gratitude that it's made them who they are.--[[User:Knmatt\|Knmatt]] 09:15, 2 November 2009 (UTC)		I do find his final act odd though - although deeply satisfying to the reader. Someone so at ease with themselves is unlikely to be so desperately angry still at his past experience. In my experience, people either wear their previously-borne slings and arrows with pride or gratitude that it's made them who they are.--[[User:Knmatt\|Knmatt]] 09:15, 2 November 2009 (UTC)
	:You meet a kinder, gentler class of people than I do, in fact or fiction. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 00:19, 3 November 2009 (UTC)		:You meet a kinder, gentler class of people than I do, in fact or fiction. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 00:19, 3 November 2009 (UTC)
			:There would be also a class who would try to improve the prospect for others and discourage the abusers, even while espousing the sentiments above. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 03:26, 17 February 2019 (UTC)

Osiris: 1 revision: Talk Namespace

2012-12-26T03:16:59Z

1 revision: Talk Namespace

← Older revision	Revision as of 03:16, 26 December 2012
(No difference)

Old Dickens: moved Talk:Madame Sharn to Talk:Sharn: no honorific

2009-12-27T04:59:13Z

moved Talk:Madame Sharn to Talk:Sharn: no honorific

New page

Assigning sexes to Dwarves, and Dwarf sexuality in general, have always been tricky. When we encounter a Dwarf/Human couple, both of whom are quite ambiguous, we have new problems. Pepe seems to be male: he refers to himself before his conversion to Dwarf as a "Lobbin Clout boy", and other indications point to a male homosexual. What do we make of "Madame" Sharn, then? "She" says that she is the King in her "mine" and she decrees that she is Queen. "Queen", of course, carries extra meanings. On the other hand, Pepe puts aside the camp persona when off-stage; is the orientation itself a pose? Why then does he mention being beaten up a lot in his youth?

On page 160 in my first reading I made a note asking if Sharn were male, then discounted the idea when no confirmation emerged. I now return to the hypothesis as the most reasonable of an eye-watering array of options. Can anyone assemble a better argument for another version? . [[User:Old Dickens|Old Dickens]] 18:02, 1 Nov 2009

This is interesting. I've always suspected that the "arrangement" between adult dwarves, wnen it comes to marriage, would in fact be a positive inducement for gay and lesbian Dwarfs to have long happy relationships. Who would know, for one thing, apart from the concerned Dwarfs themselves? And given that ninety per cent of a Dwarf courtship consists of trying to discreetly and subtly discover what gender the other Dwarf is under the chainmail and the beard... well, accidents must happen. And in a race even whose human member (Carrot) is notoriously prudish and hung-up on matters sexual, perhaps a lot of newly-married Dwarfs don't even realise they're in same-sex relationships and take it to be perfectly unremarkeable that they each have the same set of genitals. They make the best of it, maybe? (As Tolkein said, ''the kind of the Dwarves grows only slowly''...)

And on Roundworld, take a gay man, who for whatever reason cannot come out of the closet, who enters into a marriage of convenience with a woman as an attempt to present a heterosexual face to the world and divert attention (there are some, and they're not all Tory MP's). The face-saving, attention-diverting, wife or girlfriend of the closet gay is commonly nicknamed a '''''beard'''''... --[[User:AgProv|AgProv]] 20:34, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

:Pepe, though, is the anti-Carrot, somewhere beyond Giamo Casanunda in general deviance from classical Dwarfishness. --[[User:Old Dickens|Old Dickens]] 21:31, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

::I read Pepe as a genuinely gay human male (although possibly short) who's escaped the Crab Bucket through drink and expressing his homosexuality so overtly that people ignore him - a bit like funny loony monks, beggars or even Death: he is granted immunity by being too obvious. I don't think he does drop the persona "off-stage", it's just that the ''outre'' campness is in abeyance when talking to those he trusts. Being gay is one thing - having no other life or ''raison d'etre'' than ''being'' gay must be terribly wearying. We all know people who, if they weren't gay, would have nothing else to be. Pepe is far more than this.

I do find his final act odd though - although deeply satisfying to the reader. Someone so at ease with themselves is unlikely to be so desperately angry still at his past experience. In my experience, people either wear their previously-borne slings and arrows with pride or gratitude that it's made them who they are.--[[User:Knmatt|Knmatt]] 09:15, 2 November 2009 (UTC)
:You meet a kinder, gentler class of people than I do, in fact or fiction. --[[User:Old Dickens|Old Dickens]] 00:19, 3 November 2009 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 23:17, 23 February 2025
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	As mentioned initially, Pepe is pretty obviously male; the question was about Sharn. I suspect that The Author was playing silly buggers again and we're not supposed to know. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 02:03, 9 February 2025 (UTC)		As mentioned initially, Pepe is pretty obviously male; the question was about Sharn. I suspect that The Author was playing silly buggers again and we're not supposed to know. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 02:03, 9 February 2025 (UTC)
	::I came here after listening to Guybrush's podcast on UA, plus having listened to the new audio version. I was going to write, essentially, what Old Dickens wrote at the top of this page. He said it much more eloquently than I could, and in 2009, even. I likewise come to the quote about her being King and declaring herself "Queen", dressing up in female clothing. I read this as a male dwarf choosing to use a female persona. [[User:Moishe Rosenbaum\|Moishe Rosenbaum]] ([[User talk:Moishe Rosenbaum\|talk]]) 01:31, 19 February 2025 (UTC)		::I came here after listening to Guybrush's podcast on UA, plus having listened to the new audio version. I was going to write, essentially, what Old Dickens wrote at the top of this page. He said it much more eloquently than I could, and in 2009, even. I likewise come to the quote about her being King and declaring herself "Queen", dressing up in female clothing. I read this as a male dwarf choosing to use a female persona. [[User:Moishe Rosenbaum\|Moishe Rosenbaum]] ([[User talk:Moishe Rosenbaum\|talk]]) 01:31, 19 February 2025 (UTC)
			:::I agree now that this does seem to be the most likely case, and I was a bit surprised it didn’t occur to me during our discussion on the show. I suppose the nature of dwarf gender obscured the options a bit! -- [[User:Guybrush\|Guybrush]] ([[User talk:Guybrush\|talk]]) 23:17, 23 February 2025 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 01:31, 19 February 2025
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	:Pratchett is on record describing Pepe, at least, as "as gay as a tree full of monkeys", so I think that makes his intent pretty clear? See [https://youtu.be/SG8xh9q1jBc?t=973 this recorded public interview from 2014] (I've linked to the start of the question where he says this). -- [[User:Guybrush\|Guybrush]] ([[User talk:Guybrush\|talk]]) 06:43, 29 January 2023 (UTC)		:Pratchett is on record describing Pepe, at least, as "as gay as a tree full of monkeys", so I think that makes his intent pretty clear? See [https://youtu.be/SG8xh9q1jBc?t=973 this recorded public interview from 2014] (I've linked to the start of the question where he says this). -- [[User:Guybrush\|Guybrush]] ([[User talk:Guybrush\|talk]]) 06:43, 29 January 2023 (UTC)
	As mentioned initially, Pepe is pretty obviously male; the question was about Sharn. I suspect that The Author was playing silly buggers again and we're not supposed to know. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 02:03, 9 February 2025 (UTC)		As mentioned initially, Pepe is pretty obviously male; the question was about Sharn. I suspect that The Author was playing silly buggers again and we're not supposed to know. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 02:03, 9 February 2025 (UTC)
			::I came here after listening to Guybrush's podcast on UA, plus having listened to the new audio version. I was going to write, essentially, what Old Dickens wrote at the top of this page. He said it much more eloquently than I could, and in 2009, even. I likewise come to the quote about her being King and declaring herself "Queen", dressing up in female clothing. I read this as a male dwarf choosing to use a female persona. [[User:Moishe Rosenbaum\|Moishe Rosenbaum]] ([[User talk:Moishe Rosenbaum\|talk]]) 01:31, 19 February 2025 (UTC)