Talk:Willikins - Revision history

Old Dickens: /* Rob Wilkins */

2023-03-26T18:44:16Z

Rob Wilkins

← Older revision		Revision as of 18:44, 26 March 2023
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	==Rob Wilkins==		==Rob Wilkins==
	It surprises me that no one has mentioned that Rob Wilkins worked with Sir Terry for more than twenty years, first as his personal assistant and later as his business manager, and indeed has now produced a memoir of this time. Surely the origin of the name Willikins?		It surprises me that no one has mentioned that Rob Wilkins worked with Sir Terry for more than twenty years, first as his personal assistant and later as his business manager, and indeed has now produced a memoir of this time. Surely the origin of the name Willikins?
			:Willikins the actor appeared in 1988, the butler in 1993. I'm not sure. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 18:44, 26 March 2023 (UTC)

	==His conflicted youth==		==His conflicted youth==

Tag at 16:06, 26 March 2023

2023-03-26T16:06:42Z

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	Regarding the connection to Jeeves, I'm not sure that Willikins could be considered as more intelligent than Sam, and also appears to set great store by Sam's opinions (from memory he seeks reassurance about joining the regiments in Jingo), something that PG Wodehose's character would not do. He reminds me more of Parker from the Thunderbirds. --[[User:Megahurts\|Megahurts]] 08:27, 11 March 2010 (UTC)		Regarding the connection to Jeeves, I'm not sure that Willikins could be considered as more intelligent than Sam, and also appears to set great store by Sam's opinions (from memory he seeks reassurance about joining the regiments in Jingo), something that PG Wodehose's character would not do. He reminds me more of Parker from the Thunderbirds. --[[User:Megahurts\|Megahurts]] 08:27, 11 March 2010 (UTC)
	:But they all proceed from Jeeves (and The Admirable Crichton before him). --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 15:08, 11 March 2010 (UTC)		:But they all proceed from Jeeves (and The Admirable Crichton before him). --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 15:08, 11 March 2010 (UTC)

			==Rob Wilkins==
			It surprises me that no one has mentioned that Rob Wilkins worked with Sir Terry for more than twenty years, first as his personal assistant and later as his business manager, and indeed has now produced a memoir of this time. Surely the origin of the name Willikins?

	==His conflicted youth==		==His conflicted youth==

Wonderful Fanny at 20:18, 29 January 2018

2018-01-29T20:18:38Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:18, 29 January 2018
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	Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Willikins has an (unnamed) appearance as the anonymous family butler of the Rankin household near the end of {{G!G!}}? He opens the door for Vimes to tell him that Sybil's around back with the dragons. [[User:Doctor Whiteface\|Doctor Whiteface]] 04:19, 24 December 2009 (UTC)		Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Willikins has an (unnamed) appearance as the anonymous family butler of the Rankin household near the end of {{G!G!}}? He opens the door for Vimes to tell him that Sybil's around back with the dragons. [[User:Doctor Whiteface\|Doctor Whiteface]] 04:19, 24 December 2009 (UTC)
	: He'd be very old, now, in that case. The butler at the time was named "Forsythe"; Willikins was mentioned but did not appear as [[the Boy]]. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 15:03, 24 December 2009 (UTC)		: He'd be very old, now, in that case. The butler at the time was named "Forsythe"; Willikins was mentioned but did not appear as [[the Boy]]. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 15:03, 24 December 2009 (UTC)
	:Yes, I would agree that it was not Willikins who opened the door to Vimes at the end of ~~Guards, Guards.~~ I think that must have been old Forsythe, based on the description: "To his amazement the door was opened by a butler, so elderly that he might have been resurrected by the knocking." [[User:Wonderful Fanny\|Wonderful Fanny]]		:Yes, I would agree that it was not Willikins who opened the door to Vimes at the end of {{G!G!}} I think that must have been old Forsythe, based on the description: "To his amazement the door was opened by a butler, so elderly that he might have been resurrected by the knocking." [[User:Wonderful Fanny\|Wonderful Fanny]]

	Regarding the connection to Jeeves, I'm not sure that Willikins could be considered as more intelligent than Sam, and also appears to set great store by Sam's opinions (from memory he seeks reassurance about joining the regiments in Jingo), something that PG Wodehose's character would not do. He reminds me more of Parker from the Thunderbirds. --[[User:Megahurts\|Megahurts]] 08:27, 11 March 2010 (UTC)		Regarding the connection to Jeeves, I'm not sure that Willikins could be considered as more intelligent than Sam, and also appears to set great store by Sam's opinions (from memory he seeks reassurance about joining the regiments in Jingo), something that PG Wodehose's character would not do. He reminds me more of Parker from the Thunderbirds. --[[User:Megahurts\|Megahurts]] 08:27, 11 March 2010 (UTC)

Wonderful Fanny at 20:17, 29 January 2018

2018-01-29T20:17:15Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:17, 29 January 2018
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	Isn't there a reference in {{NW}} to Willikins being just the mere under-boy's assistant gofer, or something equally minimalist, in the Ramkin householD? It's the scene where Vimes has been pitched back in time 30 years but, not being fully aware of this, sprints back "home" to a house that isn't his home any more, bursts in, demands to speak to Willikins. The then butler (who really isn't paid for this sort of thing, and certainly does not have Willikins' street-fighting acumen) gets haughty, tells Vimes that if he's family he should know better than to come to the front door... Vimes then punches him out, and is only forced to leave by a younger Sybil ("She'd been so young! She looked sixteen!" ~~{{NW}})~~[[User:Wonderful Fanny\|Wonderful Fanny]] going for him with a two-handed broadsword in defense of old Forsythe. (At this point he realises he really HAS fallen thirty years into the past: it also enables the ungallant to put an age to Sybil). So maybe worth mentioning: Willikins has spent a lifetime in the Ramkin family service, punctuated briefly by military service. I don't have {{NW}} to hand right now, though, so I can't remember Willikin's exact lowly position in the below-stairs heirarchy at this time.--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:18, 3 December 2007 (CET)		Isn't there a reference in {{NW}} to Willikins being just the mere under-boy's assistant gofer, or something equally minimalist, in the Ramkin householD? It's the scene where Vimes has been pitched back in time 30 years but, not being fully aware of this, sprints back "home" to a house that isn't his home any more, bursts in, demands to speak to Willikins. The then butler (who really isn't paid for this sort of thing, and certainly does not have Willikins' street-fighting acumen) gets haughty, tells Vimes that if he's family he should know better than to come to the front door... Vimes then punches him out, and is only forced to leave by a younger Sybil ("She'd been so young! She looked sixteen!" [[User:Wonderful Fanny\|Wonderful Fanny]]) going for him with a two-handed broadsword in defense of old Forsythe. (At this point he realises he really HAS fallen thirty years into the past: it also enables the ungallant to put an age to Sybil). So maybe worth mentioning: Willikins has spent a lifetime in the Ramkin family service, punctuated briefly by military service. I don't have {{NW}} to hand right now, though, so I can't remember Willikin's exact lowly position in the below-stairs heirarchy at this time.--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:18, 3 December 2007 (CET)

	Another thought that occurs here..... as annotation, doesn't one Bruce Wayne have a butler who is perfect in all the standard butlering skills, including the optional extras of helping to actively deter assassins, martial arts, streetfighting and so forth? As Bruce Wayne is also a crimefighter who has to wear a silly uniform involving tights, this may be pertinent--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:24, 3 December 2007 (CET)...		Another thought that occurs here..... as annotation, doesn't one Bruce Wayne have a butler who is perfect in all the standard butlering skills, including the optional extras of helping to actively deter assassins, martial arts, streetfighting and so forth? As Bruce Wayne is also a crimefighter who has to wear a silly uniform involving tights, this may be pertinent--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:24, 3 December 2007 (CET)...

Wonderful Fanny at 20:16, 29 January 2018

2018-01-29T20:16:39Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:16, 29 January 2018
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	Isn't there a reference in {{NW}} to Willikins being just the mere under-boy's assistant gofer, or something equally minimalist, in the Ramkin householD? It's the scene where Vimes has been pitched back in time 30 years but, not being fully aware of this, sprints back "home" to a house that isn't his home any more, bursts in, demands to speak to Willikins. The then butler (who really isn't paid for this sort of thing, and certainly does not have Willikins' street-fighting acumen) gets haughty, tells Vimes that if he's family he should know better than to come to the front door... Vimes then punches him out, and is only forced to leave by a younger Sybil ("She'd been so young! She looked sixteen!" {{NW}}) going for him with a two-handed broadsword in defense of old Forsythe. (At this point he realises he really HAS fallen thirty years into the past: it also enables the ungallant to put an age to Sybil). So maybe worth mentioning: Willikins has spent a lifetime in the Ramkin family service, punctuated briefly by military service. I don't have {{NW}} to hand right now, though, so I can't remember Willikin's exact lowly position in the below-stairs heirarchy at this time.--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:18, 3 December 2007 (CET)		Isn't there a reference in {{NW}} to Willikins being just the mere under-boy's assistant gofer, or something equally minimalist, in the Ramkin householD? It's the scene where Vimes has been pitched back in time 30 years but, not being fully aware of this, sprints back "home" to a house that isn't his home any more, bursts in, demands to speak to Willikins. The then butler (who really isn't paid for this sort of thing, and certainly does not have Willikins' street-fighting acumen) gets haughty, tells Vimes that if he's family he should know better than to come to the front door... Vimes then punches him out, and is only forced to leave by a younger Sybil ("She'd been so young! She looked sixteen!" {{NW}})[[User:Wonderful Fanny\|Wonderful Fanny]] going for him with a two-handed broadsword in defense of old Forsythe. (At this point he realises he really HAS fallen thirty years into the past: it also enables the ungallant to put an age to Sybil). So maybe worth mentioning: Willikins has spent a lifetime in the Ramkin family service, punctuated briefly by military service. I don't have {{NW}} to hand right now, though, so I can't remember Willikin's exact lowly position in the below-stairs heirarchy at this time.--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:18, 3 December 2007 (CET)

	Another thought that occurs here..... as annotation, doesn't one Bruce Wayne have a butler who is perfect in all the standard butlering skills, including the optional extras of helping to actively deter assassins, martial arts, streetfighting and so forth? As Bruce Wayne is also a crimefighter who has to wear a silly uniform involving tights, this may be pertinent--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:24, 3 December 2007 (CET)...		Another thought that occurs here..... as annotation, doesn't one Bruce Wayne have a butler who is perfect in all the standard butlering skills, including the optional extras of helping to actively deter assassins, martial arts, streetfighting and so forth? As Bruce Wayne is also a crimefighter who has to wear a silly uniform involving tights, this may be pertinent--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:24, 3 December 2007 (CET)...
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	==His conflicted youth==		==His conflicted youth==
	Now, Willikins seems to have been [[The Boy]] at the Ramkin mansion at the time of the [[Glorious Revolution]]. This would have had him living in the house in [[Ankh (city)\|Ankh]] and deterred from participation in the activities of the [[Shamlegger Street]] Rude Boys. It would also suggest that he was several years younger than [[Sam Vimes]] (ca. 18 years) since a lad of his talent must have advanced to Footman or such by then. How would Sam ever have encountered him in a rumble in the Shades? --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:51, 26 December 2012 (PST)		Now, Willikins seems to have been [[The Boy]] at the Ramkin mansion at the time of the [[Glorious Revolution]]. This would have had him living in the house in [[Ankh (city)\|Ankh]] and deterred from participation in the activities of the [[Shamlegger Street]] Rude Boys. It would also suggest that he was several years younger than [[Sam Vimes]] (ca. 18 years) since a lad of his talent must have advanced to Footman or such by then. How would Sam ever have encountered him in a rumble in the Shades? --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:51, 26 December 2012 (PST)
	:Yes, old Forsythe refers to Willikins as the scullery boy in {{NW}}. And I agree that Willikins' involvement in Shamlegger gang doesn't quite fit with growing up in Ramkin service.		:Yes, old Forsythe refers to Willikins as the scullery boy in {{NW}}. And I agree that Willikins' involvement in Shamlegger gang doesn't quite fit with growing up in Ramkin service. [[User:Wonderful Fanny\|Wonderful Fanny]]
	== Guild of domestic servants ==		== Guild of domestic servants ==

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	Found it! The [[Guild of Butlers, Valets and Gentlemen's Gentlemen]]. It's described in {{CAM}}[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] ([[User talk:AgProv\|talk]]) 21:59, 23 December 2015 (UTC)		Found it! The [[Guild of Butlers, Valets and Gentlemen's Gentlemen]]. It's described in {{CAM}}[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] ([[User talk:AgProv\|talk]]) 21:59, 23 December 2015 (UTC)
	:~~Willikins does seem to be well connected with his peers~~. In ~~SNUFF~~, when Sam offers ~~him~~ a drink at the Ramkin estate, he declines, saying, "It's just not done, sir. I would be a laughingstock in the League of Gentlemen's Gentlemen if I was so impertinent as to have a drink with my employer. It would be getting ideas above my station, sir."		:Yes, indeed. In {{SN}}, when Sam offers Willikins a drink at the Ramkin estate, he declines, saying, "It's just not done, sir. I would be a laughingstock in the League of Gentlemen's Gentlemen if I was so impertinent as to have a drink with my employer. It would be getting ideas above my station, sir."[[User:Wonderful Fanny\|Wonderful Fanny]]

Wonderful Fanny at 20:04, 29 January 2018

2018-01-29T20:04:22Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:04, 29 January 2018
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	Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Willikins has an (unnamed) appearance as the anonymous family butler of the Rankin household near the end of {{G!G!}}? He opens the door for Vimes to tell him that Sybil's around back with the dragons. [[User:Doctor Whiteface\|Doctor Whiteface]] 04:19, 24 December 2009 (UTC)		Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Willikins has an (unnamed) appearance as the anonymous family butler of the Rankin household near the end of {{G!G!}}? He opens the door for Vimes to tell him that Sybil's around back with the dragons. [[User:Doctor Whiteface\|Doctor Whiteface]] 04:19, 24 December 2009 (UTC)
	: He'd be very old, now, in that case. The butler at the time was named "Forsythe"; Willikins was mentioned but did not appear as [[the Boy]]. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 15:03, 24 December 2009 (UTC)		: He'd be very old, now, in that case. The butler at the time was named "Forsythe"; Willikins was mentioned but did not appear as [[the Boy]]. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 15:03, 24 December 2009 (UTC)
	:Yes, I would agree that it was not Willikins who opened the door to Vimes at the end of Guards, Guards. I think that must have been old Forsythe, based on the description: "To his amazement the door was opened by a butler, so elderly that he might have been resurrected by the knocking."		:Yes, I would agree that it was not Willikins who opened the door to Vimes at the end of Guards, Guards. I think that must have been old Forsythe, based on the description: "To his amazement the door was opened by a butler, so elderly that he might have been resurrected by the knocking." [[User:Wonderful Fanny\|Wonderful Fanny]]

	Regarding the connection to Jeeves, I'm not sure that Willikins could be considered as more intelligent than Sam, and also appears to set great store by Sam's opinions (from memory he seeks reassurance about joining the regiments in Jingo), something that PG Wodehose's character would not do. He reminds me more of Parker from the Thunderbirds. --[[User:Megahurts\|Megahurts]] 08:27, 11 March 2010 (UTC)		Regarding the connection to Jeeves, I'm not sure that Willikins could be considered as more intelligent than Sam, and also appears to set great store by Sam's opinions (from memory he seeks reassurance about joining the regiments in Jingo), something that PG Wodehose's character would not do. He reminds me more of Parker from the Thunderbirds. --[[User:Megahurts\|Megahurts]] 08:27, 11 March 2010 (UTC)

Wonderful Fanny: Added quote from SNUFF, where Willikins refers to League of Gentlemen's Gentlemen

2018-01-29T19:56:33Z

Added quote from SNUFF, where Willikins refers to League of Gentlemen's Gentlemen

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:56, 29 January 2018
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	Isn't there a reference in {{NW}} to Willikins being just the mere under-boy's assistant gofer, or something equally minimalist, in the Ramkin ~~household~~? ~~(Yes, there is indeed.)~~ It's the scene where Vimes has been pitched back in time 30 years but, not being fully aware of this, sprints back "home" to a house that isn't his home any more, bursts in, demands to speak to Willikins. The then butler (who really isn't paid for this sort of thing, and certainly does not have Willikins' street-fighting acumen) gets haughty, tells Vimes that if he's family he should know better than to come to the front door... Vimes then punches him out, and is only forced to leave by a younger Sybil ("She'd been so young! She looked sixteen!" {{NW}}) going for him with a two-handed broadsword in defense of old Forsythe. (At this point he realises he really HAS fallen thirty years into the past: it also enables the ungallant to put an age to Sybil). So maybe worth mentioning: Willikins has spent a lifetime in the Ramkin family service, punctuated briefly by military service. I don't have {{NW}} to hand right now, though, so I can't remember Willikin's exact lowly position in the below-stairs heirarchy at this time.--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:18, 3 December 2007 (CET)		Isn't there a reference in {{NW}} to Willikins being just the mere under-boy's assistant gofer, or something equally minimalist, in the Ramkin householD? It's the scene where Vimes has been pitched back in time 30 years but, not being fully aware of this, sprints back "home" to a house that isn't his home any more, bursts in, demands to speak to Willikins. The then butler (who really isn't paid for this sort of thing, and certainly does not have Willikins' street-fighting acumen) gets haughty, tells Vimes that if he's family he should know better than to come to the front door... Vimes then punches him out, and is only forced to leave by a younger Sybil ("She'd been so young! She looked sixteen!" {{NW}}) going for him with a two-handed broadsword in defense of old Forsythe. (At this point he realises he really HAS fallen thirty years into the past: it also enables the ungallant to put an age to Sybil). So maybe worth mentioning: Willikins has spent a lifetime in the Ramkin family service, punctuated briefly by military service. I don't have {{NW}} to hand right now, though, so I can't remember Willikin's exact lowly position in the below-stairs heirarchy at this time.--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:18, 3 December 2007 (CET)

	Another thought that occurs here..... as annotation, doesn't one Bruce Wayne have a butler who is perfect in all the standard butlering skills, including the optional extras of helping to actively deter assassins, martial arts, streetfighting and so forth? As Bruce Wayne is also a crimefighter who has to wear a silly uniform involving tights, this may be pertinent--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:24, 3 December 2007 (CET)...		Another thought that occurs here..... as annotation, doesn't one Bruce Wayne have a butler who is perfect in all the standard butlering skills, including the optional extras of helping to actively deter assassins, martial arts, streetfighting and so forth? As Bruce Wayne is also a crimefighter who has to wear a silly uniform involving tights, this may be pertinent--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:24, 3 December 2007 (CET)...
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	Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Willikins has an (unnamed) appearance as the anonymous family butler of the Rankin household near the end of {{G!G!}}? He opens the door for Vimes to tell him that Sybil's around back with the dragons. [[User:Doctor Whiteface\|Doctor Whiteface]] 04:19, 24 December 2009 (UTC)		Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Willikins has an (unnamed) appearance as the anonymous family butler of the Rankin household near the end of {{G!G!}}? He opens the door for Vimes to tell him that Sybil's around back with the dragons. [[User:Doctor Whiteface\|Doctor Whiteface]] 04:19, 24 December 2009 (UTC)
	: He'd be very old, now, in that case. The butler at the time was named "Forsythe"; Willikins was mentioned but did not appear as [[the Boy]]. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 15:03, 24 December 2009 (UTC)		: He'd be very old, now, in that case. The butler at the time was named "Forsythe"; Willikins was mentioned but did not appear as [[the Boy]]. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 15:03, 24 December 2009 (UTC)
	Yes, I would agree that it was not Willikins who opened the door to Vimes at the end of Guards, Guards. I think that must have been old Forsythe, based on the description: "To his amazement the door was opened by a butler, so elderly that he might have been resurrected by the knocking."		:Yes, I would agree that it was not Willikins who opened the door to Vimes at the end of Guards, Guards. I think that must have been old Forsythe, based on the description: "To his amazement the door was opened by a butler, so elderly that he might have been resurrected by the knocking."

	Regarding the connection to Jeeves, I'm not sure that Willikins could be considered as more intelligent than Sam, and also appears to set great store by Sam's opinions (from memory he seeks reassurance about joining the regiments in Jingo), something that PG Wodehose's character would not do. He reminds me more of Parker from the Thunderbirds. --[[User:Megahurts\|Megahurts]] 08:27, 11 March 2010 (UTC)		Regarding the connection to Jeeves, I'm not sure that Willikins could be considered as more intelligent than Sam, and also appears to set great store by Sam's opinions (from memory he seeks reassurance about joining the regiments in Jingo), something that PG Wodehose's character would not do. He reminds me more of Parker from the Thunderbirds. --[[User:Megahurts\|Megahurts]] 08:27, 11 March 2010 (UTC)
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	==His conflicted youth==		==His conflicted youth==
	Now, Willikins seems to have been [[The Boy]] at the Ramkin mansion at the time of the [[Glorious Revolution]]. This would have had him living in the house in [[Ankh (city)\|Ankh]] and deterred from participation in the activities of the [[Shamlegger Street]] Rude Boys. It would also suggest that he was several years younger than [[Sam Vimes]] (ca. 18 years) since a lad of his talent must have advanced to Footman or such by then. How would Sam ever have encountered him in a rumble in the Shades? --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:51, 26 December 2012 (PST)		Now, Willikins seems to have been [[The Boy]] at the Ramkin mansion at the time of the [[Glorious Revolution]]. This would have had him living in the house in [[Ankh (city)\|Ankh]] and deterred from participation in the activities of the [[Shamlegger Street]] Rude Boys. It would also suggest that he was several years younger than [[Sam Vimes]] (ca. 18 years) since a lad of his talent must have advanced to Footman or such by then. How would Sam ever have encountered him in a rumble in the Shades? --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 19:51, 26 December 2012 (PST)
			:Yes, old Forsythe refers to Willikins as the scullery boy in {{NW}}. And I agree that Willikins' involvement in Shamlegger gang doesn't quite fit with growing up in Ramkin service.
	== Guild of domestic servants ==		== Guild of domestic servants ==

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	Found it! The [[Guild of Butlers, Valets and Gentlemen's Gentlemen]]. It's described in {{CAM}}[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] ([[User talk:AgProv\|talk]]) 21:59, 23 December 2015 (UTC)		Found it! The [[Guild of Butlers, Valets and Gentlemen's Gentlemen]]. It's described in {{CAM}}[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] ([[User talk:AgProv\|talk]]) 21:59, 23 December 2015 (UTC)
			:Willikins does seem to be well connected with his peers. In SNUFF, when Sam offers him a drink at the Ramkin estate, he declines, saying, "It's just not done, sir. I would be a laughingstock in the League of Gentlemen's Gentlemen if I was so impertinent as to have a drink with my employer. It would be getting ideas above my station, sir."

Wonderful Fanny: Clarified old butler was Forsythe, Willikins was only a scullery boy, and clarified that the text states that Sybil appeared to be sixteen years old (not ten years old, as someone said) in Night Watch, 30 years ago)

2018-01-29T19:37:52Z

Clarified old butler was Forsythe, Willikins was only a scullery boy, and clarified that the text states that Sybil appeared to be sixteen years old (not ten years old, as someone said) in Night Watch, 30 years ago)

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:37, 29 January 2018
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	Isn't there a reference in {{NW}} to Willikins being just the mere under-boy's assistant gofer, or something equally minimalist, in the Ramkin household? It's the scene where Vimes has been pitched back in time 30 years but, not being fully aware of this, sprints back "home" to a house that isn't his home any more, bursts in, demands to speak to Willikins. The then butler (who really isn't paid for this sort of thing, and certainly does not have Willikins' street-fighting acumen) gets haughty, tells Vimes that if he's family he should know better than to come to the front door... Vimes then punches him out, and is only forced to leave by a ~~ten or eleven or twelve year old~~ Sybil going for him with a two-handed broadsword. (At this point he realises he really HAS fallen thirty years into the past: it also enables the ungallant to put an age to Sybil). So maybe worth mentioning: Willikins has spent a lifetime in the Ramkin family service, punctuated briefly by ~~mili tary~~ service. I don't have {{NW}} to hand right now, though, so I can't remember Willikin's exact lowly position in the below-stairs heirarchy at this time.--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:18, 3 December 2007 (CET)		Isn't there a reference in {{NW}} to Willikins being just the mere under-boy's assistant gofer, or something equally minimalist, in the Ramkin household? (Yes, there is indeed.) It's the scene where Vimes has been pitched back in time 30 years but, not being fully aware of this, sprints back "home" to a house that isn't his home any more, bursts in, demands to speak to Willikins. The then butler (who really isn't paid for this sort of thing, and certainly does not have Willikins' street-fighting acumen) gets haughty, tells Vimes that if he's family he should know better than to come to the front door... Vimes then punches him out, and is only forced to leave by a younger Sybil ("She'd been so young! She looked sixteen!" {{NW}}) going for him with a two-handed broadsword in defense of old Forsythe. (At this point he realises he really HAS fallen thirty years into the past: it also enables the ungallant to put an age to Sybil). So maybe worth mentioning: Willikins has spent a lifetime in the Ramkin family service, punctuated briefly by military service. I don't have {{NW}} to hand right now, though, so I can't remember Willikin's exact lowly position in the below-stairs heirarchy at this time.--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:18, 3 December 2007 (CET)

	Another thought that occurs here..... as annotation, doesn't one Bruce Wayne have a butler who is perfect in all the standard butlering skills, including the optional extras of helping to actively deter assassins, martial arts, streetfighting and so forth? As Bruce Wayne is also a crimefighter who has to wear a silly uniform involving tights, this may be pertinent--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:24, 3 December 2007 (CET)...		Another thought that occurs here..... as annotation, doesn't one Bruce Wayne have a butler who is perfect in all the standard butlering skills, including the optional extras of helping to actively deter assassins, martial arts, streetfighting and so forth? As Bruce Wayne is also a crimefighter who has to wear a silly uniform involving tights, this may be pertinent--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:24, 3 December 2007 (CET)...
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	Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Willikins has an (unnamed) appearance as the anonymous family butler of the Rankin household near the end of {{G!G!}}? He opens the door for Vimes to tell him that Sybil's around back with the dragons. [[User:Doctor Whiteface\|Doctor Whiteface]] 04:19, 24 December 2009 (UTC)		Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Willikins has an (unnamed) appearance as the anonymous family butler of the Rankin household near the end of {{G!G!}}? He opens the door for Vimes to tell him that Sybil's around back with the dragons. [[User:Doctor Whiteface\|Doctor Whiteface]] 04:19, 24 December 2009 (UTC)
	: He'd be very old, now, in that case. The butler at the time was named "Forsythe"; Willikins was mentioned but did not appear as [[the Boy]]. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 15:03, 24 December 2009 (UTC)		: He'd be very old, now, in that case. The butler at the time was named "Forsythe"; Willikins was mentioned but did not appear as [[the Boy]]. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 15:03, 24 December 2009 (UTC)
			Yes, I would agree that it was not Willikins who opened the door to Vimes at the end of Guards, Guards. I think that must have been old Forsythe, based on the description: "To his amazement the door was opened by a butler, so elderly that he might have been resurrected by the knocking."

	Regarding the connection to Jeeves, I'm not sure that Willikins could be considered as more intelligent than Sam, and also appears to set great store by Sam's opinions (from memory he seeks reassurance about joining the regiments in Jingo), something that PG Wodehose's character would not do. He reminds me more of Parker from the Thunderbirds. --[[User:Megahurts\|Megahurts]] 08:27, 11 March 2010 (UTC)		Regarding the connection to Jeeves, I'm not sure that Willikins could be considered as more intelligent than Sam, and also appears to set great store by Sam's opinions (from memory he seeks reassurance about joining the regiments in Jingo), something that PG Wodehose's character would not do. He reminds me more of Parker from the Thunderbirds. --[[User:Megahurts\|Megahurts]] 08:27, 11 March 2010 (UTC)

AgProv: /* Guild of domestic servants */ killing redlink

2017-01-09T23:55:06Z

Guild of domestic servants: killing redlink

← Older revision		Revision as of 23:55, 9 January 2017
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	Is there a reference somewhere to Willikins having rank in a Guild of Butlers, Senior Domestic Servants and Gentlemen's Gentlemen? I'm really not sure if this is in canon or fanfic... (mind rotted by fan writing) and I don't want to add it till I'm sure it's canon...[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] ([[User talk:AgProv\|talk]]) 01:46, 9 August 2015 (UTC)		Is there a reference somewhere to Willikins having rank in a Guild of Butlers, Senior Domestic Servants and Gentlemen's Gentlemen? I'm really not sure if this is in canon or fanfic... (mind rotted by fan writing) and I don't want to add it till I'm sure it's canon...[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] ([[User talk:AgProv\|talk]]) 01:46, 9 August 2015 (UTC)
	:Someone added a [[Butlers' Guild]] to the [[Guilds of Ankh-Morpork]] page, without support. I don't remember it. Fanfic is a mixed blessing. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 04:22, 9 August 2015 (UTC)		:Someone added a Butlers' Guild to the [[Guilds of Ankh-Morpork]] page, without support. I don't remember it. Fanfic is a mixed blessing. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 04:22, 9 August 2015 (UTC)

	Found it! The [[Guild of Butlers, Valets and Gentlemen's Gentlemen]]. It's described in {{CAM}}[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] ([[User talk:AgProv\|talk]]) 21:59, 23 December 2015 (UTC)		Found it! The [[Guild of Butlers, Valets and Gentlemen's Gentlemen]]. It's described in {{CAM}}[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] ([[User talk:AgProv\|talk]]) 21:59, 23 December 2015 (UTC)

AgProv: /* Guild of domestic servants */

2015-12-23T21:59:28Z

Guild of domestic servants

← Older revision		Revision as of 21:59, 23 December 2015
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	Is there a reference somewhere to Willikins having rank in a Guild of Butlers, Senior Domestic Servants and Gentlemen's Gentlemen? I'm really not sure if this is in canon or fanfic... (mind rotted by fan writing) and I don't want to add it till I'm sure it's canon...[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] ([[User talk:AgProv\|talk]]) 01:46, 9 August 2015 (UTC)		Is there a reference somewhere to Willikins having rank in a Guild of Butlers, Senior Domestic Servants and Gentlemen's Gentlemen? I'm really not sure if this is in canon or fanfic... (mind rotted by fan writing) and I don't want to add it till I'm sure it's canon...[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] ([[User talk:AgProv\|talk]]) 01:46, 9 August 2015 (UTC)
	:Someone added a [[Butlers' Guild]] to the [[Guilds of Ankh-Morpork]] page, without support. I don't remember it. Fanfic is a mixed blessing. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 04:22, 9 August 2015 (UTC)		:Someone added a [[Butlers' Guild]] to the [[Guilds of Ankh-Morpork]] page, without support. I don't remember it. Fanfic is a mixed blessing. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 04:22, 9 August 2015 (UTC)

			Found it! The [[Guild of Butlers, Valets and Gentlemen's Gentlemen]]. It's described in {{CAM}}[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] ([[User talk:AgProv\|talk]]) 21:59, 23 December 2015 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:18, 29 January 2018
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	Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Willikins has an (unnamed) appearance as the anonymous family butler of the Rankin household near the end of {{G!G!}}? He opens the door for Vimes to tell him that Sybil's around back with the dragons. [[User:Doctor Whiteface\|Doctor Whiteface]] 04:19, 24 December 2009 (UTC)		Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Willikins has an (unnamed) appearance as the anonymous family butler of the Rankin household near the end of {{G!G!}}? He opens the door for Vimes to tell him that Sybil's around back with the dragons. [[User:Doctor Whiteface\|Doctor Whiteface]] 04:19, 24 December 2009 (UTC)
	: He'd be very old, now, in that case. The butler at the time was named "Forsythe"; Willikins was mentioned but did not appear as [[the Boy]]. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 15:03, 24 December 2009 (UTC)		: He'd be very old, now, in that case. The butler at the time was named "Forsythe"; Willikins was mentioned but did not appear as [[the Boy]]. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 15:03, 24 December 2009 (UTC)
	:Yes, I would agree that it was not Willikins who opened the door to Vimes at the end of ~~Guards, Guards.~~ I think that must have been old Forsythe, based on the description: "To his amazement the door was opened by a butler, so elderly that he might have been resurrected by the knocking." [[User:Wonderful Fanny\|Wonderful Fanny]]		:Yes, I would agree that it was not Willikins who opened the door to Vimes at the end of {{G!G!}} I think that must have been old Forsythe, based on the description: "To his amazement the door was opened by a butler, so elderly that he might have been resurrected by the knocking." [[User:Wonderful Fanny\|Wonderful Fanny]]

	Regarding the connection to Jeeves, I'm not sure that Willikins could be considered as more intelligent than Sam, and also appears to set great store by Sam's opinions (from memory he seeks reassurance about joining the regiments in Jingo), something that PG Wodehose's character would not do. He reminds me more of Parker from the Thunderbirds. --[[User:Megahurts\|Megahurts]] 08:27, 11 March 2010 (UTC)		Regarding the connection to Jeeves, I'm not sure that Willikins could be considered as more intelligent than Sam, and also appears to set great store by Sam's opinions (from memory he seeks reassurance about joining the regiments in Jingo), something that PG Wodehose's character would not do. He reminds me more of Parker from the Thunderbirds. --[[User:Megahurts\|Megahurts]] 08:27, 11 March 2010 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:04, 29 January 2018
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	Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Willikins has an (unnamed) appearance as the anonymous family butler of the Rankin household near the end of {{G!G!}}? He opens the door for Vimes to tell him that Sybil's around back with the dragons. [[User:Doctor Whiteface\|Doctor Whiteface]] 04:19, 24 December 2009 (UTC)		Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Willikins has an (unnamed) appearance as the anonymous family butler of the Rankin household near the end of {{G!G!}}? He opens the door for Vimes to tell him that Sybil's around back with the dragons. [[User:Doctor Whiteface\|Doctor Whiteface]] 04:19, 24 December 2009 (UTC)
	: He'd be very old, now, in that case. The butler at the time was named "Forsythe"; Willikins was mentioned but did not appear as [[the Boy]]. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 15:03, 24 December 2009 (UTC)		: He'd be very old, now, in that case. The butler at the time was named "Forsythe"; Willikins was mentioned but did not appear as [[the Boy]]. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 15:03, 24 December 2009 (UTC)
	:Yes, I would agree that it was not Willikins who opened the door to Vimes at the end of Guards, Guards. I think that must have been old Forsythe, based on the description: "To his amazement the door was opened by a butler, so elderly that he might have been resurrected by the knocking."		:Yes, I would agree that it was not Willikins who opened the door to Vimes at the end of Guards, Guards. I think that must have been old Forsythe, based on the description: "To his amazement the door was opened by a butler, so elderly that he might have been resurrected by the knocking." [[User:Wonderful Fanny\|Wonderful Fanny]]

	Regarding the connection to Jeeves, I'm not sure that Willikins could be considered as more intelligent than Sam, and also appears to set great store by Sam's opinions (from memory he seeks reassurance about joining the regiments in Jingo), something that PG Wodehose's character would not do. He reminds me more of Parker from the Thunderbirds. --[[User:Megahurts\|Megahurts]] 08:27, 11 March 2010 (UTC)		Regarding the connection to Jeeves, I'm not sure that Willikins could be considered as more intelligent than Sam, and also appears to set great store by Sam's opinions (from memory he seeks reassurance about joining the regiments in Jingo), something that PG Wodehose's character would not do. He reminds me more of Parker from the Thunderbirds. --[[User:Megahurts\|Megahurts]] 08:27, 11 March 2010 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:37, 29 January 2018
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	Isn't there a reference in {{NW}} to Willikins being just the mere under-boy's assistant gofer, or something equally minimalist, in the Ramkin household? It's the scene where Vimes has been pitched back in time 30 years but, not being fully aware of this, sprints back "home" to a house that isn't his home any more, bursts in, demands to speak to Willikins. The then butler (who really isn't paid for this sort of thing, and certainly does not have Willikins' street-fighting acumen) gets haughty, tells Vimes that if he's family he should know better than to come to the front door... Vimes then punches him out, and is only forced to leave by a ~~ten or eleven or twelve year old~~ Sybil going for him with a two-handed broadsword. (At this point he realises he really HAS fallen thirty years into the past: it also enables the ungallant to put an age to Sybil). So maybe worth mentioning: Willikins has spent a lifetime in the Ramkin family service, punctuated briefly by ~~mili tary~~ service. I don't have {{NW}} to hand right now, though, so I can't remember Willikin's exact lowly position in the below-stairs heirarchy at this time.--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:18, 3 December 2007 (CET)		Isn't there a reference in {{NW}} to Willikins being just the mere under-boy's assistant gofer, or something equally minimalist, in the Ramkin household? (Yes, there is indeed.) It's the scene where Vimes has been pitched back in time 30 years but, not being fully aware of this, sprints back "home" to a house that isn't his home any more, bursts in, demands to speak to Willikins. The then butler (who really isn't paid for this sort of thing, and certainly does not have Willikins' street-fighting acumen) gets haughty, tells Vimes that if he's family he should know better than to come to the front door... Vimes then punches him out, and is only forced to leave by a younger Sybil ("She'd been so young! She looked sixteen!" {{NW}}) going for him with a two-handed broadsword in defense of old Forsythe. (At this point he realises he really HAS fallen thirty years into the past: it also enables the ungallant to put an age to Sybil). So maybe worth mentioning: Willikins has spent a lifetime in the Ramkin family service, punctuated briefly by military service. I don't have {{NW}} to hand right now, though, so I can't remember Willikin's exact lowly position in the below-stairs heirarchy at this time.--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:18, 3 December 2007 (CET)

	Another thought that occurs here..... as annotation, doesn't one Bruce Wayne have a butler who is perfect in all the standard butlering skills, including the optional extras of helping to actively deter assassins, martial arts, streetfighting and so forth? As Bruce Wayne is also a crimefighter who has to wear a silly uniform involving tights, this may be pertinent--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:24, 3 December 2007 (CET)...		Another thought that occurs here..... as annotation, doesn't one Bruce Wayne have a butler who is perfect in all the standard butlering skills, including the optional extras of helping to actively deter assassins, martial arts, streetfighting and so forth? As Bruce Wayne is also a crimefighter who has to wear a silly uniform involving tights, this may be pertinent--[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] 11:24, 3 December 2007 (CET)...
Line 5:		Line 5:
	Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Willikins has an (unnamed) appearance as the anonymous family butler of the Rankin household near the end of {{G!G!}}? He opens the door for Vimes to tell him that Sybil's around back with the dragons. [[User:Doctor Whiteface\|Doctor Whiteface]] 04:19, 24 December 2009 (UTC)		Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Willikins has an (unnamed) appearance as the anonymous family butler of the Rankin household near the end of {{G!G!}}? He opens the door for Vimes to tell him that Sybil's around back with the dragons. [[User:Doctor Whiteface\|Doctor Whiteface]] 04:19, 24 December 2009 (UTC)
	: He'd be very old, now, in that case. The butler at the time was named "Forsythe"; Willikins was mentioned but did not appear as [[the Boy]]. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 15:03, 24 December 2009 (UTC)		: He'd be very old, now, in that case. The butler at the time was named "Forsythe"; Willikins was mentioned but did not appear as [[the Boy]]. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] 15:03, 24 December 2009 (UTC)
			Yes, I would agree that it was not Willikins who opened the door to Vimes at the end of Guards, Guards. I think that must have been old Forsythe, based on the description: "To his amazement the door was opened by a butler, so elderly that he might have been resurrected by the knocking."

	Regarding the connection to Jeeves, I'm not sure that Willikins could be considered as more intelligent than Sam, and also appears to set great store by Sam's opinions (from memory he seeks reassurance about joining the regiments in Jingo), something that PG Wodehose's character would not do. He reminds me more of Parker from the Thunderbirds. --[[User:Megahurts\|Megahurts]] 08:27, 11 March 2010 (UTC)		Regarding the connection to Jeeves, I'm not sure that Willikins could be considered as more intelligent than Sam, and also appears to set great store by Sam's opinions (from memory he seeks reassurance about joining the regiments in Jingo), something that PG Wodehose's character would not do. He reminds me more of Parker from the Thunderbirds. --[[User:Megahurts\|Megahurts]] 08:27, 11 March 2010 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 23:55, 9 January 2017
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	Is there a reference somewhere to Willikins having rank in a Guild of Butlers, Senior Domestic Servants and Gentlemen's Gentlemen? I'm really not sure if this is in canon or fanfic... (mind rotted by fan writing) and I don't want to add it till I'm sure it's canon...[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] ([[User talk:AgProv\|talk]]) 01:46, 9 August 2015 (UTC)		Is there a reference somewhere to Willikins having rank in a Guild of Butlers, Senior Domestic Servants and Gentlemen's Gentlemen? I'm really not sure if this is in canon or fanfic... (mind rotted by fan writing) and I don't want to add it till I'm sure it's canon...[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] ([[User talk:AgProv\|talk]]) 01:46, 9 August 2015 (UTC)
	:Someone added a [[Butlers' Guild]] to the [[Guilds of Ankh-Morpork]] page, without support. I don't remember it. Fanfic is a mixed blessing. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 04:22, 9 August 2015 (UTC)		:Someone added a Butlers' Guild to the [[Guilds of Ankh-Morpork]] page, without support. I don't remember it. Fanfic is a mixed blessing. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 04:22, 9 August 2015 (UTC)

	Found it! The [[Guild of Butlers, Valets and Gentlemen's Gentlemen]]. It's described in {{CAM}}[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] ([[User talk:AgProv\|talk]]) 21:59, 23 December 2015 (UTC)		Found it! The [[Guild of Butlers, Valets and Gentlemen's Gentlemen]]. It's described in {{CAM}}[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] ([[User talk:AgProv\|talk]]) 21:59, 23 December 2015 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 21:59, 23 December 2015
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	Is there a reference somewhere to Willikins having rank in a Guild of Butlers, Senior Domestic Servants and Gentlemen's Gentlemen? I'm really not sure if this is in canon or fanfic... (mind rotted by fan writing) and I don't want to add it till I'm sure it's canon...[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] ([[User talk:AgProv\|talk]]) 01:46, 9 August 2015 (UTC)		Is there a reference somewhere to Willikins having rank in a Guild of Butlers, Senior Domestic Servants and Gentlemen's Gentlemen? I'm really not sure if this is in canon or fanfic... (mind rotted by fan writing) and I don't want to add it till I'm sure it's canon...[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] ([[User talk:AgProv\|talk]]) 01:46, 9 August 2015 (UTC)
	:Someone added a [[Butlers' Guild]] to the [[Guilds of Ankh-Morpork]] page, without support. I don't remember it. Fanfic is a mixed blessing. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 04:22, 9 August 2015 (UTC)		:Someone added a [[Butlers' Guild]] to the [[Guilds of Ankh-Morpork]] page, without support. I don't remember it. Fanfic is a mixed blessing. --[[User:Old Dickens\|Old Dickens]] ([[User talk:Old Dickens\|talk]]) 04:22, 9 August 2015 (UTC)

			Found it! The [[Guild of Butlers, Valets and Gentlemen's Gentlemen]]. It's described in {{CAM}}[[User:AgProv\|AgProv]] ([[User talk:AgProv\|talk]]) 21:59, 23 December 2015 (UTC)